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Is there a difference between "good players" and "tryhards"?

Discussion in 'Server Discussion' started by ALotOfDragons, Jan 10, 2021.

  1. So I see this often. People referring to anyone better than them as a "sweat/tryhard," instead of just referring to them as a good player. Do you think that good players and tryhards are the same type of person?

    Because I don't.

    The way I see it, good players are people that have good game sense and know good strategies. They are good enough to know how to do well with putting in minimal effort. I feel like they use fair tactics instead of relying on "cheap shots" for easy wins and that they are conscious of what is considered "fair" or not. I think that good players don't care about farming wins and XP, they just care about the experience of the game and they do it for fun and for practice and they are always striving to get better. I also think that most good players try to play fairly instead of taking advantage of something broken and I also think that most good players are also good sports and willing to help a fellow player out. And they don't get upset at losing, because that's just the course of the game.

    However, tryhards just seem to be trying too hard. I feel like they are the people who probably spend an unhealthy amount of time on the game. And they act like they only care about winning, but they don't really think of a good strategy. For example, in a PVP game they would probably be the person to just rush in with jitterclicking 25cps instead of better strategies, such as strafing or w-tapping. (But tbh, 25cps is rlly good so some respect) But then I lose that respect when they try to take cheap shots or deliberately break rules, such as teaming in solo games or even closet hacking. Tryhards don't try to get better at the game because they think they are already the best and they have toxic attitudes, especially when they lose.

    So yeah that is what I think is the difference between a tryhard and a good player. So next time you are about to call someone a tryhard, stop to think that they might not actually be a -snip- and maybe like, a good player?
     
    Posted Jan 10, 2021
    Krxo, Blazette, Hubble and 5 others like this.
  2. It might be a hard pill to swallow but depending how you define it, tryhards are also good players. I suppose it all depends on how you define a "good player", in your words you put it as someone that doesn't go for cheap shots and learns different strategies, etc. In my words, a good player is just one that can win a lot. There isn't more to it.

    Tryhards can win a lot, however the difference between a tryhard/sweat and what I would call a striking or impressive player is the fact that tryhards go for the minimal effort, painfully identical strategies each game and got a lack of will to experiment and have fun with the game. Impressive players, in my point of view, are players that don't necessarily chase the leaderboards. They toy around with the game and play to enjoy it, not necessarily to win. Chances are, these players are also effortlessly really good at the game, but it's not their main goal. From my experience, these are the players that are really recognised within a community for their interesting and unique strategies. They're also the players that have friends.
     
    Posted Jan 10, 2021
  3. Maybe necroposting here, but there's not necessarily a difference between a "tryhard" and a "good player". It can be argued that both good players and what you define as a "tryhard" are one and the same: someone that's good at the game. There's different types of good players. "Tryhards" aren't bad at the game just because they spawn rush or use what you define as a "painfully identical" strategy. It's just they're more concerned about winning faster, and they enjoy doing so. Nothing wrong with that.

    What you define as a tryhard will have friends, that's part of the reason people define them as tryhards. They run over people as a full party and then get accused of being cheap, and a tryhard. It is simply a playstyle.

    Closet Hacking is a massive problem, but not all "tryhards" are toxic people who cheat. Most of them are legitimately good players who are accused of being a tryhard because of their in game attitude. Hey, I'm not defending them for being rude/toxic in game, however you cannot deny they are not good at the game they're playing. Define better strategies? Most of my friends are what you would probably call a "tryhard" and they a/d tap (what you'd call strafing) and w tap. Just because they use minimal effort strategies like rushing at the start of the game does not mean they are bad or tryhards.
     
    Posted Jan 12, 2021
    okDamien, ALotOfDragons and Fusafez like this.
  4. Good players are players that have spent years playing games and have gotten better because they find a game enjoyable.

    Tryhard are players that have spent years playing games and have gotten better but they play for statistics.

    Typically also are toxic and closet

    Nah you're good
     
    Posted Jan 12, 2021
    ALotOfDragons likes this.
  5. Bro unfortunately I cannot take your word on this as you are sitting on about 7.4 million damage taken and 300k damage dealt. People who aren't as versed in pvp often think that better players are cheating, which is unfortunate. Nothing against you personally of course, as I do think you are a rather nice person, it's just that your word isnt really credible for this point.
     
    Posted Jan 12, 2021
  6. Who is this supposed to be directed to
     
    OP OP
    OP OP Posted Jan 12, 2021
  7. Well honestly I wasn't making a reference to spawn rushing here. And that is not necessarily what I meant by a cheap strategy. In fact, the reason I was trying to be so vague is so that people can fill "cheap strategies" in with the own opinion. Why? Because everyone has a different opinion on what a cheap strategy is. And I'm not just speaking for myself, I'm also using some of the things I found on other threads. Clearly some people are going to think that rushing in cakewars is a tryhard strategy and they can think that if they want. But I personally don't have an opinion on that specific strat.

    Ok so I didn't mean that like all of them were cheating or being toxic. I meant that most of the people who I notice doing it were acting like tryhards in the first place. I guess anyone can be toxic, so it's just that my "tryhards" are toxic 9/10 times. But cheating is different because it's not usually an experienced "good" player doing it, it's usually a lower level. However, I feel like the number of hackers isn't thathigh, it's not like I see them every time I log on. Again, I didn't mean all of the tryhards are cheating or toxic, my bad if that wasn't clear in my other post

    Another thing is that I believe that there are more good players than people who strictly fall into the tryhard definition. Yes, some players do try hard, but I also feel like in some cases, good players and tryhards can be their own category, but i do realize that there is more than a spectrum.
     
    OP OP
    OP OP Posted Jan 12, 2021,
    Last edited Jan 12, 2021
    maevestarbaby likes this.
  8. To answer OP's question, no; I don't think there's a difference between "good players" and "tryhards." It's just a matter of vocabulary, and I certainly wouldn't count closet cheaters as "tryhards." People tend to use "tryhards" to describe skilled players who play to farm wins or stats, and I've seen lots of people saying they take "cheap shots," but that's just a matter of personal opinion, and it varies between games. I personally am a casual CW player, but I've been called a "tryhard" because I like to use archer kit to shoot people into the void (when I'm obviously not one).

    In Castle Siege particularly, lots of people are considered "tryhards" for using strategies like ghoul routes or juking to win the game, which aren't bland or repetitive at all, but people get upset when it causes the game to end quickly, which is often considered toxic. On the other hand, drawing out a game can also be seen as toxic. It's an arbitrary line that gets drawn. I know plenty of people that are labeled "tryhards" in CS, and they've been playing for years; they're not toxic, and they don't closet. When I get called a "tryhard," I always take it with a grain of salt. More often than not, people just use it when they get upset after losing a fight or game, and not all good players should be assumed to be toxic or closeters, as that simply isn't true.
     
    Posted Jan 12, 2021
    rmotheram, SALB and ALotOfDragons like this.
  9. I think the terms 'good players' and 'tryhards' seem similar. But I think they aren't the same.
    All iPhones are phones, but not all phones are iPhones. I think the same can be said in this scenario.
    All tryhards are good players, but not all good players are tryhards. Plenty of good players have a genuine interest in the community rather than the game they specialize in. I think that is immediately the biggest distinction between tryhards and non-tryhards. Tryhards crave victory and good stats. Good players crave to learn more about the players who play the game.
     
    Posted Jan 12, 2021
    okDamien, Blazette, Hubble and 3 others like this.
  10. What if a player finds enjoyment from gaining statistics?
    A good player in my eyes is simply one that can hold their own in a game without having to put their all in. You can want to win and do well without giving it too much thought - and to me, that warrants the title of a "good player". In my eyes, tryharding isn't much of a thing. It's an excuse used by players who are losing and mad to give reason to their failure. "He's destroying me, why not call him a tryhard to feel better about myself?".
    I'd agree with @Dwasserd in this scenario, all tryhards are good players, but a good player can also play casually and still win - meaning they aren't a tryhard. But again, I don't truly believe that anyone is a tryhard.
     
    Posted Jan 12, 2021
    ALotOfDragons and Fusafez like this.
  11. They have basically the same meaning as most people said above. The difference is the meaning intended by the sender. A "good player" has a positive connotation implied. "Tryhard" is basically seen as a negative or derogatory statement.
     
    Posted Jan 12, 2021,
    Last edited Jan 12, 2021
    okDamien, shihanna, Sunkeiss and 2 others like this.
  12. In my eyes, there is a boundary between tryhard and good player. A good player is someone who has played a game for quite a long time to be able to know the mechanics, strategies, what to do, etc. Whereas Tryhards are people who have went past that boundery. It's in the name "try hard". They try as hard as they can and can usually click 1000 cps with one finger. At this point, you are just playing to rack up wins.
     
    Posted Jan 12, 2021
    ALotOfDragons and Blazette like this.
  13. Tryharding revolves around stats

    Good players are typically just there for fun who also tend to win a lot
     
    Posted Jan 12, 2021
  14. Yes, I'm playing to WIN the game. That's the point of playing the game itself. "Tryharding" is a an excuse given by players who are getting destroyed and want to feel better about themselves. "Its okay, I'm not trash, it's just that the other guy is a no life, tryhard, yeah thats it!"
     
    Posted Jan 13, 2021
    anthxny likes this.
  15. i started playing mineplex bedrock in January of 2018. i always help out players who ask questions too. then at the same time i tryhard snow fight and im #1. im not toxic in chat either usually. so does this make me a tryhard or a good player? as others have said, it's what your opinion is on who is a tryhard and who is a good player. its easy to tell who is a tryhard on mineplex bedrock because most of the players have random names and jump pvp. only tryhards jump pvp. they also tend to have no rank these tryhards, so i presume that they main hive. hive is a really sweaty and tryhard type of server.
     
    Posted Jan 13, 2021
    ALotOfDragons likes this.
  16. Ahhh yes just because I want to win more games then the average player automatically means Ima tryhard. I play the game to win, not to lose. Losing isn’t fun, and I want to have a fun experience. So if me “trying” my best to win makes me a tryhard. Then okay
     
    Posted Jan 13, 2021
    anthxny likes this.
  17. Preach, I know my fair share of tryhards and good players. As someone who mainly only plays Mineplex to play SSM, I deal with these two types of players a lot. I personally only play SSM for fun and good matches, if I'm set up with noobs I usually just leave, and occasionally try to play different kits to get more enjoyment out of the game, but dont depend on busted kits to get wins. The tryhards in this game mode ALWAYS pick the most broken kits, never play anything else or try to experiment, usually target the best player as well, which isn't bad but it gets irritating when their kit is so busted, AND can overall be very toxic, win or lost. Another thing is the constant trucing and forced 1v1s, they'd bring a friend over who you'd basically have to fight both at a time instead of them fighting each other. Its super rare to find nice people in the game that dont depend on cheap/broken stuff, but when you do the game is crazy fun. I also think the people getting offended by this post should really take a look at themselves and think about "why" your being called a "tryhard".
     
    Posted Jan 13, 2021,
    Last edited Jan 13, 2021
    ALotOfDragons likes this.
  18. I think that this thread has a point and I think a few responses in particular also make really good points.

    I personally consider myself a generally good player. I know how to rod PvP decently, I'm outlandishly good with a bow and I'm pretty good at Speed Builders from experience. This doesn't exactly mean I'm a try hard though since I lose a good amount of my games as well. Take for example, my SG2 W/L ratio. I have almost 500 wins to 1300 games played, which is a pretty decent W/L to have, especially with the targeting that staff often get and the games where one unfortunately gets killed by a hacker. This doesn't make it any less of a team effort however considering it's a team game. If we compare my Solo SG W/L to my SG2 W/L, you'll find that my team stats outweigh my solo stats by far with a 100/500 W/L in Solos.

    So, at the end of the day, I feel that team effort plays a lot into team games considering you're bound to face more than one opponent at points of the game, and winning or losing those fights can make all the difference to your team winning or losing the game.

    A well coordinated team will always outrank an uncoordinated team; this is prevalent in CakeWars "sweats", which often times rush bases. As annoying as this can be, it's a super effective strategy because instead of waiting for another team to become more powerful than them, they claim the middle beacon to begin stocking power up resources while they attack the other players who are still on an even playing field. Then upon death, they gain more power while the team they rushed (if they're successful in fending off the attack) is now less powerful than them based on the powerup the team gains from holding middle beacon. It makes sense how this is an overpowered and commonly seen Good strategy.

    I think the moral of the story is that there are a lot of good players and good teams, but as far as 'tryhards' go, I don't think anyone plays games for any other reason than to enjoy the game at the end of the day, regardless of whether they are going for wins. No one likes losing; some people just mind is less than others. Does that make them 'tryhards'? Not exactly. Add in the factor of lobby-hopping or "dodging" and of course a team will seem like they're good at times. Abusing this function for the sake of wins doesn't make a team 'tryhards' though; they just take advantage of the fact that they can have easier games against newer players instead of versing teams that are higher ranking than them and better coordinated.

    As stated also and as I've neglected to mention through this reply, some 'tryhards' aren't actually as good as they seem due to stat boosting, Autoclickers, Modified Knockback, Reach and other various closet cheats. While this doesn't always happen to be the case, it sometimes is, and I think that closeting is a dishonest way of calling yourself good. The feeling of overpowering your enemy through ingenuity is dishonorable and honestly slightly shameful. Instead of investing the time into the game and a team to become better, resorting to cheating is never fair and serves no respect to the player or their team.

    That's all I have to add on this topic honestly.
    Take care,
    ~Hub
     
    Posted Jan 13, 2021
    ALotOfDragons, Amg and Fusafez like this.
  19. I do not necessarily see a difference between the two that you mentioned.
    I feel like the term Tryhard was actually invented to be used as a rude comment towards players who are good at the game.
    As Hubble has said above, I don't think that anyone would force themselves to play a game that they don't enjoy or have fun in.
    Everyone likes to win games and nobody likes to lose, mostly.
    If you play the game enough you will gather experience and game sense and become good at the game, making you a good player. At that point, once you fight people who are not as experienced as you and may not be on the same skill level, you can be called a "Tryhard" even though all that you're doing is playing the game to the best of your abilities and using the knowledge/experience that you've gathered over the time that you've been playing.
    I personally do not like the term Tryhard, as it's mostly used in a negative manner and in order to make someone who is good at the game feel bad about spending time and effort into learning to play the way that they do.
    This is just my opinion though and I understand if you disagree with me.
    Have a great day/night!
    - Petar
     
    Posted Jan 13, 2021
    Fusafez likes this.
  20. If I, trying my best to win a game and have fun with my friends is me being a "tryhard", then screw it, I'm a tryhard.
     
    Posted Jan 14, 2021

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