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Hardcore Clans Requirement; a Blockade to New Players.

Discussion in 'General Idea Discussion' started by Tr1xstr, Oct 22, 2021.

  1. As a returning player from the early days of Mineplex, I have a love for the original Champions kits and was ecstatic to give Clans a shot. Playing with the old kits in a new way would be tons of fun but I ran into one dire issue: A 20-hour Casual Playtime Requirement. I should also mention there is an AFK kick timer & a rule against 'Farming Hours.'

    A year or two ago, this would have been no issue as the lobbies would be active, but today the only population of players lays within Hardcore Clans. After a few hours of my near solo Clans experience, I gave up. Mineplex does not bolster the population these days to place such a requirement on a game mode. Contrary to the original intent of easing players into Clans, the current system acts as a hurdle to players and possible server growth. Realizing the situation of the player count and adapting to it could greatly benefit Mineplex through the slower winter months.

    The solution? Lift the barricade, let the players in. Perhaps add a warning for the challenging aspects of the game but at least let the players try it and join the community. Take a look at Hypixels UHC for example, a super challenging game that is not well suited for new players. Everyone level 10+ can join and a warning of the difficulty of the game is displayed in the join menu.

    On another note, perhaps the reason for the blockage could be alternative accounts or cheating. I suggest this be countered with a level cap of ~10-25 to discourage such behaviour.

    Clans is unique and nostalgic. I see no reason this game mode shouldn't be a selling point to the whole server.
     
    Posted Oct 22, 2021
    Kugzer likes this.
  2. It's to give new players a chance to learn clans before playing hardcore as it has a lot more features than casual and is also makes it harder for cheaters to play as they need to get 20 hours to play the more popular Hardcore servers.
     
    Posted Oct 22, 2021
    Tr1xstr likes this.
  3. Yes, I understand that. As mentioned in the original post, it is counterintuitive as Mineplex doesn't have the player base it used to, leading to a Casual experience in solitary or with only a few others. Twenty hours of solo gameplay is worth no one's time. This mechanic removes growth in the Clans community almost completely.

    To this point I suggest a level cap instead of a playtime cap, something more realistic and achievable.
     
    OP OP
    OP OP Posted Oct 22, 2021
  4. What is a level cap meant to be? If you can kill a certain amount of players? This would be even easier for cheaters
     
    Posted Oct 22, 2021
    Tr1xstr likes this.
  5. If this were to be removed, clans would be ruined. Everyone, and I mean EVERYONE cheats (not me tho). You'd be surprised by the amount of closet cheaters and the coding people spent their time doing in order to make their own cheats such as auto evade, auto bottle, etc. Everyone also knows GWEN is hot garbage and we are hoping they're working on the update. I have hope with the current developers but it just takes so long because they can only do so much. Mineplex is also doing a very poor job promoting clans. As you said it's a very unique game, and currently is the most played game other than Halloween Havoc. Other than Nano Games and SSM, everything else is COMPLETELY dead. All we hope is for Season 7 to come out, that'll definitely increase the player count.
     
    Posted Oct 22, 2021
    Tr1xstr likes this.
  6. When it comes to Minecraft, a game with almost zero cheat engine, you have to be realistic. Cheats will always be a thing unless Minecraft itself steps in, especially on mini-game servers such as Mineplex. It is wishful thinking to believe this next update will cleanse the server of all cheaters; no amount of time or money poured into an Anti Cheat could 'save' a server like Mineplex. In this case, take Hypixel as a comparison. This server employs multiple Anti Cheat developers, paying them 100 grand a year. Over the years, Watchdog, Hypixels Anti Cheat, has grown in value and has likely had over $1,000,000 worth of work poured into it. Unfortunately, players still cheat blatantly with ease on the server, resulting in reduced player counts in competitive games. An update to Mineplex could be record-breaking, the best seen and recorded, but would still be unable to beat closet cheaters. Again, unless Minecraft itself steps in, cheating will continue to exist everywhere.

    One unique feature of Hardcore Clans is the fact that it holds players. Many games are completely unplayable because of a low player count. Because only 4 or so games fill, players are checking out all these games but are barricaded from Hardcore Clans because no Casual lobbies fill and Hardcore requires a 20-hour Casual playtime. Mineplex is shooting themselves in the foot here. Currently, there are only a few playable games, Mineplex should be capitalizing on the games that are filling.
     
    OP OP
    OP OP Posted Oct 22, 2021
  7. Level as in Mineplex level, the number displayed before your name, the thing that exp increases. This would be easier for everyone, that is the point. If cheaters wished to use alternative accounts, it would be quite challenging to level them up to standard and likely just not worth the time.
     
    OP OP
    OP OP Posted Oct 22, 2021
  8. Hypixel has been doing a great job dealing with cheats, and yes it's still always gonna happen in some way. With Clans, it's all about the abilities. Using normal cheats such as autoclicker, kill aura, and fly hacks won't ever fly in hardcore clans. For example, if someone is auto clicking with aimbot as a knight and knows nothing about abilities, you can just evade and blockhit spam to kill them. Either GWEN will detect the cheats or they get reported and will have to log on another account with 20 hours of casual clans. Any legends and warpoints lost will also be recovered. The problem here comes down to closet cheats that are meant to bypass clans specifically. First of all I have no idea why any other version besides 1.8 isn't disabled on clans when they know for a fact that auto evade only works on 1.12, or something like that. Secondly, things like flash fly can easily happen due to the ability allowing you to basically fly through the air for a split second, only this time the cheaters speed it up and fly for longer. Things like this are the main problem with clans, rather than normal cheats.


    Couldn't agree more! Should've always had the rule of the map resetting every 3 months, regardless of whether or not there will be an update. One idea I had in mind that some people may not agree on is that legends should not be allowed in casual (rares would still be allowed). Closet cheaters will have alts on casual and cheat to gain legends and ruin the server for noobs because they keep killing everyone with their legend sets. Just a thought...
     
    Posted Oct 22, 2021
    Tr1xstr likes this.
  9. I agree, there will always be cheats, but I question how this means we should not allow players into Hardcore Clans.

    To ask a direct question, do you think the Casual Playtime Requirement is a good thing?
     
    OP OP
    OP OP Posted Oct 22, 2021
  10. With hardcore clans, if everyone was allowed, you would constantly die to countless cheaters losing not only warpoints but your set and weapons and literally anything you have on you, and it goes to the cheater making it even easier to kill other people.

    Casual playtime requirement was a great thing at first, but now Mineplex is doing nothing to promote it or give anyone a reason to start playing on casual. I can't think of anything else other than playtime that prevents cheaters from getting in to hardcore easier
     
    Posted Oct 22, 2021
    Tr1xstr likes this.
  11. Yeah, I agree with this but look at players in my situation. I'm a level 27 with ~2 days total in-game playtime at the moment, if I were blatantly cheating, I would have been caught by now. The current system blocks out people like me, players who just want to try clans but don't want to do so completely alone. I want the actual clans experience, not 20 hours of solo survival.

    This is why I suggest the level floor. Players who are high enough level to be trusted but haven't played clans are able to get into clans. Perhaps they don't even need to remove the playtime requirement but simply add an either-or, allowing trusted players in while making new players try casual or generally play the server before joining Hardcore Clans.
     
    OP OP
    OP OP Posted Oct 22, 2021
  12. Not everyone who will try clans will be a high level and may not enjoy the other games on Mineplex. I know lots of people who are low levels on Mineplex but have days in-game in clans as they enjoy clans but clans doesn't give XP.

    Casual is a good place to start playing clans as you learn about the basics such as events, where shops are the different kits and territories and Charles Witherton Raids. I have 18 days in clans and most of that is from Casual as I played on Clans-9 for a long time and enjoyed playing clans and stayed on Clans-9 until I got alt accounts to play on different servers. You have 50 minutes in Clans and from that you probably don't fully understand everything about clans and why hardcore is a lot harder with war points and players who have played clans for a long time who are skilled as well as the high amount of cheaters.

    If you want to go play hardcore, you could just AFK for 20 hours moving every few minutes or you could try doing some events and learning the game properly before going to hardcore. I recommend you read the Clans Guide Book for more information. 20 hours Requirement should stay and is more beneficial for new players to learn clans and making it harder for cheaters to play on hardcore. There are still people who play on Casual servers, if you look on the map on Clans-9 there are a reasonable amount of Clans on it and I see quite a few people who still play Casual servers as well as new players who join and don't know how to play who quit in a few minutes. If people want to stay and learn it is easier on casual.
     
    Posted Oct 22, 2021
  13. Hey venez!

    I'm not sure you've understood my post or read my previous postings so I've provided a Coles Notes version relevant to your response.

    Main Suggestion: Make the Hardcore Clans requirement the following
    A player must have EITHER 20 hours playtime in Casual OR be level (undecided but I suggest 10-20)

    Straight from the rulebook is no time farming. https://www.mineplex.com/clansrules/

    https://imgur.com/a/9L9MIDb <---- This is Clans-9 at the hours I am able to play on a Friday, there are zero players in casual but ~40 in hardcore. If I wanted to play alone I would not be in multiplayer on a server.

    To this, I ask how and why it is more beneficial for new players?

    In my opinion, It seems clear very few to no new players get through, the blockage of growth is not beneficial for anyone.
     
    OP OP
    OP OP Posted Oct 23, 2021
  14. Clans is such a hard game to learn that regardless of the requirements new players aren't going to take the time to play. If they're forced to play on casual they'll be crushed by cheaters, the few stacked players who play, boredom with nothing to do, or general confusion of how to play. If they're able to play on hardcore right off the bat they'll be crushed by less blatant cheaters they can't get staff to ban, power clans, boredom with nothing to do, or general confusion of how to play. Focus on making the game as a whole accessible to new players (tutorials, things for small clans to do, more pve related events, less toxic community, etc) before worrying about the requirements forced on new players. Right now, pretty much no new player wants to play the game at all, regardless of hardcore or casual.
     
    Posted Oct 23, 2021
  15. There can be several high level players or old accounts with high levels that can turn to be cheaters. I think in your situation it's just unlucky and there's not much there can be done about it. Unless they come up with something new, I think clans should keep the casual playtime.
     
    Posted Oct 23, 2021
  16. From personal experience a level requirement for hardcore would be better at keeping out hackers than the current 20 hour system, meaning adding it as an alternative wouldn't really do much harm. The main type of hackers the 20 hour limit seeks to stop are blatant alters (which I was) who hack on NFA alts using blatant hacks like bhop, fly, and kill aura. The other type, (closet hackers) use hacks that staff can't really ban for on SFA or FA alts, and each of their accounts lasts far longer than a blatant hacker's alt.
    For myself, I never hacked on hardcore, as it wasn't worth it to afk an alt for 20 hours only to get it banned in 10 minutes. There are some who do AFK NFAs to 20 hours, but a level cap (like 20) would be more efficient at stopping this. To get 20 hours, all you need to do is anti-AFK overnight, but to get to level 20 you'd have to grind out games (likely legit to not get caught) for quite a while in order to play for 10 minutes on hardcore clans before getting banned.
    The number of accounts I got that were level 20+ were very very low. Out of the likely thousands of accounts I hacked on over the course of a couple years, only 5-10 level 20+.
    If someone wants to play on hardcore clans without afking on casual for 20 hours (assuming they're an active player of mineplex, maybe champions) they should be able to.
     
    Posted Oct 24, 2021
    Tr1xstr likes this.
  17. Yeah, that's true, as if you go in clans discords there are players like TZR andy and players like them who grind levels/ hours on clans and selling them for 20.
     
    Posted Oct 24, 2021
  18. Yeah I'm one of those players lol. It's easier to grind an account to 20 hours than it is to get one to level 20, so adding this wouldn't change much.
     
    Posted Oct 25, 2021
    Kugzer likes this.

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