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Bring Back Deploy Platform Suffocation to CW

Discussion in 'Cake Wars' started by Infui, May 1, 2020.

?

Should the Deploy Platform Suffocation Method be added back to Mineplex?

  1. YES! STRAIGHT AWAY!

    22.4%
  2. No.

    72.4%
  3. Maybe, I have to think about it.

    5.2%
  1. Hey there.

    I may get some people who'll hate this thread, but eh.

    In my opinion, I think that Mineplex should add back the builder suffocation method to cw. I thought that the builder suffocation method/deploy platform suffocation made the game more interesting. I've heard a few people who disliked the new update, and I've also seen people love the new update. Also, from the new update, sometimes platforms wont place correctly if you're next to an entity or a player.

    The update would have been better if the platforms could suffocate people only on an opposing team, and not your teammate. For those people who said that the builder suffocation method, is an "exploit" for 3 years, please reconsider your choice of words, I'd say it's more of a PvP strategy, because it's also really easy to counter or to avoid, since the maximum amount of deploy platforms is only 5, (Unless you buy more, but that's a different story.) I hope the Mineplex team may consider this to be implemented in the game.

    Please vote on the poll to add back deploy platform suffo or not.
     
    Posted May 1, 2020
  2. I have to disagree with this. The whole point of Builder was to provide players with inexpensive and fast mobility, not to suffocate players. This "strategy" was cheeky, infuriating, and abused the design of the kit. I'm very glad it's gone, and I certainly don't anticipate it coming back.

    I appreciate your bringing this up with no suffocation against teammates, however. Certainly a fresh take on the situation, so kudos to you regardless.
     
    Posted May 1, 2020
  3. I don't because the builder can still be used to trap players, but not in an overpowered way. Suffocation shouldn't be brought back because then the class would be op compared to say, warrior. (imo I think warrior needs to be buffed)
     
    Posted May 1, 2020
    Infui and AlwaysTakingWs / Jacob like this.
  4. more than anything, whether or not you believe builder should've had suffocating or not, it was a viable tactic in order to compete with frosting. frosting allows you to kill other people on other teams so much easier than if you were to not be frosting, the fact that builder had a tactic in suffocating made the kids balanced in a weird and twisted way. they removed suffocating because "builder shouldnt be a pvp kit, and shouldnt have pvp aspects" yet in doing that they also hurt builders utility potential, and also left frosting on top.
    i want suffocating back because frosting being at the top is boring and unbalanced, having 2 kits that can compete for it though makes the game more interesting, especially with builder since builder was probably the only kit with any tangible depth. archer and frosting being the best just makes the game extremely degenerate
     
    Posted May 2, 2020
  5. Yeah frosting is annoying as heck.
     
    Posted May 2, 2020
    kim_crazy, ARareBlackBear and Infui like this.
  6. frosting is an achievement kit, and it was already nerfed way too heavily. The game is finally balanced and you have to admit it.
     
    Posted May 2, 2020
    Infui and Chuck104 like this.
  7. wow id love to agree with you if you provided a reason? builder got nerfed way harder than frosting did, and removing slowness barely does anything, you can still easily combo people with frost
     
    Posted May 2, 2020
  8. I mean it was pretty easy to avoid the suffocation. Idrk why 16 people voted for suffo to not return. I think frosting is still a bit more OP because of what @Kalpek said. also frosting should be limited to 2 or if not 1 snowball, instead of 3 or 4.
     
    OP OP
    OP OP Posted May 2, 2020
    Kalpek likes this.
  9. They were both rather difficult to avoid, and both had little risk to user for high reward which was not really okay. The only real consistent counter to suffo was to "suffo them better" which is just dumb, especially for something that shouldn't have been impacting gameplay as much as it was. If something is good to the point that using it is the best/only option to beating it then that's not good for balancing.The notion that removing slowness wasn't a big nerf to frosting is just flat out wrong- the kit is good for combos still , no doubt, but without slowness they actually have to work to keep the combo going instead of the opponent being practically immobilized. Both were annoying to deal with and provided too much of an unfair advantage for the user so both were appropriately nerfed.
     
    Posted May 2, 2020
  10. you didnt need to suffo the person better who was suffoing you to get out? believe it or not there are things you can do to position yourself to not getting suffocated, whether you bait them to use the platforms, or prematurely place a block to get over the platforms, there were many ways to avoid it, not to mention there was a consistent bug that allowed players to hit you even though they were suffocated, along with players randomly phasing out of suffocations or just popping on top.
    example of this:
    suffocating was not this "end all be all" scenario, there were many times in which it would fail, and many players who were smart enough to actually avoid being suffocated

    i dont know why everyone continues to say frosting got nerfed hard without slowness, losing the slowness doesnt take away from the combo or make it easier to get out of the combo, your own movement speed is irrelevant if the one using frosting is properly comboing you. if you get caught in a combo, slowness doesnt hinder you just as much as speed wont help you, its all down to hoping they accidentally inch close enough to you to where you can hit them.

    either way, there's no way to compare the 2 nerfs, even if i were to lie and say that the removal of slowness was a big deal and hindered fighting for frosting, it still wouldnt compare to the nerf builder got. builder lost its one niche in fighting which was suffocating, and whether or not you believe builder should or should not be a pvp kit, it had a niche and now its gone. frosting didnt lose its ability to combo people like builder lost it's ability to provide anything in fights at all, which is why frosting is still the best and the game is overall less balanced than before, since frosting was already better than builder yet barely got tapped when builder lost its fighting potential entirely
     
    Posted May 2, 2020
    Infui likes this.
  11. Hi there!

    As seen by the overwhelmingly negative response to this idea being proposed, I don't think I need to elaborate too much.

    All I would say is that I think Deploy Platforms were designed mostly for players to get from one place to another faster, and was never designed to use in the way of suffocating other players.

    As such, I am really against this idea, and I really hope this idea does not get through.

    -1. (Would -5 if I could, because this is a really, really terrible idea.)
     
    Posted May 2, 2020
  12. Ok but we shouldn't be relying on a bug to justify a mechanic being balanced lol. Aside from that, block placing and jumping over lets them have low ground advantage, and repositioning doesn't do much aside from resetting the fight, in which case they can just try again or spam more. And obviously if it was so easy to counter there wouldn't be so many people against it's return/complaining about it in the first place.

    The slowness most definitely does make a difference. It's easier to start a combo when the opponent has less mobility and without the slowness you can actually back out of the combo in most cases rather than being practically stuck.

    And builder was never supposed to have a niche in fighting in the first place. That's why it's called builder. It's meant to build. It's actual niche is mobility and that has remained unchanged. If you want a pvp crutch, go frost or archer. That's simply not builder's role.
     
    Posted May 2, 2020
    Infui likes this.
  13. if you're trying to use lowground as a justification for a reason builder was "op", consider playing against someone with frost? where the have a much bigger advantage than just lowground? and whether or not bugs made builder balanced, it was indeed balanced, also you cant just run and reset to spam more platforms, you only get 5, while they cover a decently wide area you can only suffocate in 2 blocks of the 9 that are placed.
    also just because you and other people werent smart enough to properly counter platforms doesnt mean they were op, its hard to believe you're actually using that as a reason for why it should be removed

    its easier to start a combo when the opponent has less mobility yea, but thats the thing, the snowball literally completely halts their momentum?? the slowness has nothing to do with the combo itself. if you really wanted to back out of the combo whats stopping you from just turning around and sprinting away?

    also i went over the arguments for whenver people say "BUILDER ISNT SUPPOSED TO BE A PVP KIT" but apparently i have to do it again.
    whether or not you believe builder should or shouldnt be a pvp kit, at one point it had a standing in pvp, therefore the game is less balanced than before and would be more balanced with suffocating, since suffocating is the only other strategy that could even slightly rival frosting snowballs, even without slowness. by removing suffocating you leave frosting at the top, and the game is less balanced because of it. i dont care if you think builder shouldnt be a pvp kit, but now its not a pvp kit, and the game is less balanced because of it.
     
    Posted May 2, 2020
    Infui and AbleToStrafe like this.
  14. Lowground is a justification because that method of "countering" still leaves you with a massive disadvantage. Bugs balancing out a kit should never be desirable, because 1. bugs can be unreliable and 2. that's promoting unintended gameplay. 5 platforms is still enough to spam or force the opponent to reset multiple times. And calling me and the roughly 80% of the people in the poll who agree with me dumb does nothing to validate your point. If it's hard/annoying for that many people, then it's hard. I guess you are just sooooo good that it's easy for you.

    "if you really wanted to back out of the combo whats stopping you from just turning around and sprinting away?"
    THE SLOWNESS IS. that's really all I have to say for this point. I cannot comprehend how anyone would not think slowness is a huge advantage in a pvp fight, even more so than a 1-2 use combo tool.

    The fact that it had a standing in pvp was what made it unbalanced. You're acting like pre-updates the game was actually balanced. It wasn't. That's why the updates happened. The fact that the mobility kit filled multiple niches and was able to be the top choice for pvp, defense, utility, ect made the game unbalanced. One kit is not meant to be good at everything. If you want a counter to frosting, play archer.
     
    Posted May 3, 2020
    Johnny Welamton and Infui like this.
  15. Hi!!

    I personally love this new update! It creates a balance between all kits. I understand why you may want suffocation back with the Builder kit as it was very useful, and change is hard which I understand. However, the nerf was necessary. I've made past posts about the update and the Builder kit is still very valuable. Builder kit still allows you to build up which is huge when it comes to Cakewars!! Being able to build high up quickly gives you tons of advantages considering you have the high ground. Furthermore, you still have great mobility with the kit. The kit is designed to be more mobile instead of it being used pvp related. Additionally, lots of tactics like placing a platform and wool over your cake if a player is rushing your open cake. The platforms also are a great way to defend yourself while you're trying to mine through a cake, it allows you to receive some more time to mine, run, and most importantly react. If we kept suffocation and remove the slowness of the Snowball kit the overall balance of the game would hands down not be where it is at today. More players will just use the powerful kit. Lastly, you're still able to trap a player. By placing a platform in front of them and one on top it also allows you to stall for extra time. Overall, the kit's nerf was necessary and you're still able to use tons of different tactics that benefit you throughout the game.
     
    Posted May 3, 2020
    Infui, Wiz2K, ddgolfer and 1 other person like this.
  16. Hello!

    I completely disagree with the idea of bringing this "strategy" back into the game. I believe that the sole purpose of the kit is to provide an edge in mobility to players who use the kit. The abilities to obtain blocks passively and to place platforms is already a big advantage over other kits. When the suffocation method worked, it was heavily abused and caused nuisance to gameplay. I view this method as a glitch in the gamemode. Although I am guilty of using the suffocation method in-game, I applaud Mineplex for removing it.
     
    Posted May 3, 2020
    Infui and VernCow like this.
  17. Hey I not gonna lie I never do it. Because to my opinion it’s not a skills if you suffocate someone to kill him while he can’t do almost anything it’s not call skills to my opinion it’s just to kill him
     
    Posted May 3, 2020
  18. I don't think it would really be a good idea to even consider adding back the mechanic of suffocation. At most, people easily took advantage of suffocation when running away from team fights with low hp, and often there was no counter play. This was a really good mechanic to get people off of the void, and also possibly kill people if they are somewhat low. Mechanics with such little counterplay make the game less satisfying, even if it might give a couple good laughs for those getting full diamonds into the void. Games should always have a prioritization of balance over making things unbalanced to make them more interesting. To make things more interesting is new kit ideas, and new updates, but then those additions introduce the problem of power creep, which many games have a problem with. I don't have much to say about this, since you can read the multiple threads on why suffocation was an annoying mechanic to deal with, with little counterplay. Even if there is some sort of counterplay, suffocation had multiple opportunities given the amount of platforms you could get with the kit. It might have been easier for those very experienced in the game, but many casuals had problems with solving the issue of suffocation. The point of the platform wasn't to suffocate the player, but to put platforms of wool for bridging. I just don't see a reason to add this mechanic back into the game, especially if the majority of the CW community disliked this mechanic.
     
    Posted May 3, 2020
    Infui likes this.
  19. I'm going to have to disagree with this. The suffocation part of the builder kit was annoying for many however it wasn't what the kit was intended for; it was intended to allow you to move faster across the map then others could especially in early game. The reason I don't think the suffocation should be back is because it's very annoying and doesn't allow any PVP which infurates a lot of players.
     
    Posted May 3, 2020
    Infui likes this.
  20. I agree with this in that it takes no skill, but frosting is the same thing O_O
     
    Posted May 3, 2020
    Infui likes this.

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