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Any ideas on how to nerf spider?

Discussion in 'Super Smash Mobs' started by EpicEnderDragon1, Dec 4, 2018.

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  1. EpicEnderDragon1

    EpicEnderDragon1

    People are talking about how spider is OP and how it’s always at the top of every tier list, but my question is what do you do to nerf it? The main thing that makes spider (and wolf) insane is it’s speed, which is gets from leap. So do we just remove leap and replace it with a normal double jump, or is that too extreme? Or do we nerf it’s cool downs and maybe it’s stats too?
     
    Posted Dec 4, 2018
  2. Jam

    Jam

    No one wants to nerf the potential that these kits have. Especially spider which a really fun kit to play with its Directed DoubleJump.

    SmashGI has been throwing around ideas to firstly bring back energy use on jumps but in a more playstyle orientated form. Double Jumps will now cost energy to use. Attacking an opponent with MELEE will give back portions of energy on-top of the gradual replenishment. This means that we can nerf the jump and speed and prevent camping without crippling the kit like last time, and it works perfectly with spiders playstyle.

    Another change was removing needlers poison because it's waaaay to good for the move itself and an unessesary over buff. And then maybe increasing needlers cooldown slightly. There was talk of Spin Web but that doesn't really need changes and isn't a significant issue compared to these others.

    Basically it's just figuring out a way to nerf the over abusable aspects of Spider without crippling it or its playstyle.
     
    Posted Dec 4, 2018
    EpicEnderDragon1 likes this.
  3. EpicEnderDragon1

    EpicEnderDragon1

    Maybe nerfing it’s attack damage? I don’t know how much it should be nerfed but I definitely think it should. It works perfectly to, spider is all about doing fast melee hits, so reducing it’s attack damage will balance out the speed and attack.
     
    OP OP
    OP OP Posted Dec 4, 2018
  4. Jam

    Jam

    Doing that cripples it's ability to not only take trades but also deal with bulkier kits. Spider is a close combat class, those usually require 5+ melee damage and spiders already got a sub average armour of 5.5. Lowering attack kinda makes it harder to get good melee combo damage and also means other kits are gonna hurt harder and make it harder for you to hurt them back.

    And I know most spider players will reeEEEE on lowered attack.
     
    Posted Dec 4, 2018
  5. FreezaSama

    FreezaSama

    I would say the only nerf Spider needs is the short cool down on Needler. I mean can I use Witherskull every 2 Seconds? (If theres not 2 seconds cooldown I deeply apologise)
    No it cant do that so Spider should have a 8 second cooldown

    What do you think about my idea?
     
    Posted Dec 5, 2018
    EpicEnderDragon1 likes this.
  6. EpicEnderDragon1

    EpicEnderDragon1

    Maybe 5 second cool down on needles? Seems more reasonable
     
    OP OP
    OP OP Posted Dec 5, 2018
  7. Eroil

    Eroil

    While wither skull is definetely weaker than it was in the past, it's still a much stronger overall projectile and so deserves a higher cooldown. I do think needler's current cooldown is too quick, and removing poison might be a good idea as the move is great for utility even without it, but 8 seconds of cooldown is way too much for that kind of projectile.
     
    Posted Dec 5, 2018
  8. FreezaSama

    FreezaSama

    What cooldown time so you suggest to put for Spider Needler?
     
    Posted Dec 5, 2018
  9. Eroil

    Eroil

    Well, I think that something like that requires testing to know if it's a good idea, but I think making it like a 3.5 (maybe even 4? Might be too much though) seconds cooldown would be a good idea. Or maybe rework it so it uses energy or something, though then that would probably have to come with other major changes to the kit that people would maybe contest to not change it too much. Again, requires testing to see what works and what doesn't, those are just some ideas.
     
    Posted Dec 5, 2018
  10. No Sleep

    No Sleep

    Lower melee damage. Can probably be as low as 4 and the kit would be very similar to play.

    Or you gotta nerf needler spam, a longer cool down.

    Or you gotta nerf its movement, I think double jump should use xp.

    I think also atm spin web is too easy to hit, they should decrease the spread and the number of webs thrown.
     
    Posted Dec 5, 2018
  11. iStabNerdsForXP

    iStabNerdsForXP

    Nerf Jump Velocity, it's too fast imo. This applies for Wolf as well. It's just really unfair in scenarios where people just spam Triple Jump and you just can't run from it. The jump also allows for stupid dodges and jukes. It's pretty unfair if you ask me.
     
    Posted Dec 5, 2018
  12. AvroVulcan

    AvroVulcan

    I mainly agree with @Jam and some of the suggestions that have been provided by SmashGI. I think adding energy to the direct double jumpwould definitely fairly nerf the kit, and replenishing energy slowly over time with big energy re-gain when melee-ing your opponents. I also like the idea of removing the poison effect on needler as it would negate the ability for it to be used as a safe and spammy poking utility.
     
    Posted Dec 5, 2018
  13. No Sleep

    No Sleep

    I think poison on needler should stay, it's a cool effect. Just get rid of the initial arrow damage and let it only deal poison damage. Less damage dealt than currently, but still get green hearts. It's a lot of fun.
     
    Posted Dec 5, 2018
  14. Puppet On A String

    Puppet On A String

    Hello!

    I would nerf its jump it's too hard to hit when it's darting around.
     
    Posted Dec 5, 2018
    EpicEnderDragon1 likes this.
  15. adabababa

    adabababa

    Hello,

    I definitely think these kits have potential, just as @Jam stated. Instead of nerfing the abilities of the kit, just nerf the speed and jump, and that'd to plenty to the kit. If you nerf a kit to much, the kit won't be used at all, and the kit would be dead. The spider kit doesn't really need to be nerfed, but if it was going to get nerfed, this would be my opinion.

    Feel free to ask my any questions.

    Have a wonderful day!
     
    Posted Dec 5, 2018
  16. EpicEnderDragon1

    EpicEnderDragon1

    Have you played SSM before? Spider needs to be nerfed, it’s literally meta right now. Nerfing speed is a good idea, but needler is also a huge problem because of it’s spam ability.
     
    OP OP
    OP OP Posted Dec 6, 2018
  17. Glitchy

    Glitchy

    Closest to a nerf it needs is less spamming on needler
     
    Posted Dec 6, 2018

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