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In Discussion A new kit and a rework for warrior

Discussion in 'New Kit Discussion' started by SpitefulNick, Sep 12, 2019.

  1. As any avid cake wars player knows, arguably the most underpowered and underused kit in the game right now is warrior.
    The kit used to receive a guaranteed 3 hearts back on kill, but it was nerfed more than a year ago (presumably) due to all the hackers using it. Since the nerf, practically nobody uses the kit anymore and lobbies tend to look something like this: 90% of players are either builder or frosting, while 10% (usually even less) are archer. Maybe 1 or 2 warriors. Maybe.

    I think instead of re-buffing the regen on the kit to make it viable again, we should scrap the iffy regen thing and give it a new perk: .25 (or .5?) more damage on sword attacks. With a slight damage boost I think the kit would become useful again, and with the regen aspect of the kit gone, it would open up a niche for a new kit to fill: the tank kit. The tank kit would be just what it's name implies. It's perk would be to have a maximum of 12 hearts, rather than 10. Pretty simple: turn warrior into a damage class, and add a new class that takes over the tank role.

    With these changes, I believe we can balance the viability of the kits, while also adding a new kit to play (which is always fun :D ).
     
    Posted Sep 12, 2019
    Flame, Gzen, Korben2005 and 1 other person like this.
  2. Hey there!

    I definitely agree in the aspect that something is needed to balance the Frosting kit as it is by far the most popularly used. An alteration and additional kit may be the perfect idea. A tank kit is very interesting, although I believe there would have to be a big weakness, to balance out the heart increase that the kit entails. Possibly a permanent negative potion effect on the user, or a missing armor piece would work? We could even go as far to say there should more than just 2 hearts added, or a different buff to add to the kit for a more impactful kit addition. Otherwise, I do think the idea is on the correct path, and I am intrigued to see other's thoughts on this!

    Thread moved to New Kit Discussion
     
    Posted Sep 12, 2019,
    Last edited Sep 12, 2019
  3. Heyo!

    I do like the concept of your idea. Being a Cake Wars player for a while as well, I have also seen the popularity die down with Warrior kit with everything that's happened over the past 2 years. Now that the hacker issue has died down and the kit has been a purchasable one for a while, I don't really see an issue with adding this. At the start of the match, this will definitely lean to be on the power overpowered side, I can see it providing to be useful towards the end of a game. One of the only issues I see with this being that if you have a diamond sword and sharpness II by the first 2-3 minutes of the game, this will become very overpowered and annoying really quick. The damage boost isn't by that much, but it is still enough to be pretty overpowered in the long run. I would agree with a small .25 damage boost, but nothing more than that. As for the heart concept, I think this would be very good. Maybe adding absorption hearts to indicate that would be good (although I'm sure this is what you were already implying). This kit may lead up to be very stacked, especially with a golden apple and Healing Station, but overall would be a good change for the kit. Overall, I'll leave it as a +0.5 for now, but am open to see change within this idea. Hopefully this helped!
     
    Posted Sep 12, 2019
  4. is it even possible to have sharp 2 within the first 3 minutes?
     
    OP OP
    OP OP Posted Sep 12, 2019
    TooMuchXMas4You likes this.
  5. I think this is a great idea +1
    However, as for the damage, I think .25 would be the optimal amount because .5 is a bit too much imo.
     
    Posted Sep 14, 2019
    SpitefulNick likes this.
  6. I actually really like both ideas and I'll go ahead and give feedback to both.
    The warriors kit change I think it much needed due to me not seeing a ton of people using the warrior kit and therefore it becoming kind of a useless kit. I think taking away regen and adding the extra damage on swords would be a decent replacement, however like a player above me mentioned if a warrior quick into the game gets a diamond sword they could kill a team of leather armored people very easily so there is one con. I do think there are more pros to cons though in this situation so great idea there.

    The next idea you suggested was to make a new kit (if I read it correctly) and it be named tank. I think the skills of this kit with 12 hearts instead of 10 would be a little too overpowered due to the fact of again if someone gets a decent sword, for example Iron and charges into a teams base early they automatically have 2 extra hearts then those players along possibly with a stronger sword. So I will have to be giving the -1 on the kit addition. I also think that Cake Wars has enough kits as it is and with the warrior change it will fix the kit balancing for the time being. Thanks for the idea I like it :D.
     
    Posted Sep 14, 2019
  7. good idea, but id do +.2 damage per HIT not per kill
     
    Posted Oct 21, 2019
  8. i like the idea of warrior not being irrelevant again and there being an actual competitor to frosting (builder has great utility but let's face it, 2 players at the same skill level with the same equipment but one has frosting? that guy's winning), but i think flat .25 right off the bat could prove to be... excessive. i can definitely see a full party with 2+ warriors that buy iron swords as soon as the game starts just completely melting the opposition, so maybe it could stack per kill? something like +.05 per kill, maxing out at .25, and losing it upon death? that way it would reward people who are actually capable of getting kills consistently and avoid introducing another crutch class to the game (yes funny haha, i, with 100 cw wins of inexperience, am calling frosting a crutch. it carries bad players and good players don't need it to be successful but are almost forced to play it because guess what, the guy over there on Yellow that can't aim to save his life just got 3 free debuffs with your name on them, enjoy the void while you're down there). overall i think this is a great idea that gives a necessary buff to an objectively pretty bad class while also providing the opportunity for a new class to fill in an interesting niche. +1, and hey this is the one game that actually gets updated so we could see this implemented very soon
     
    Posted Oct 21, 2019,
    Last edited Oct 21, 2019
  9. 1 I would like to point out you said +.5 every kill with a max of .25.
    2 I think that it should stack based on every hit without taking dmg. You could get a huge advantage but only if you have skill. It would not max out but it would wear off after 10 seconds of not fighting.
     
    Posted Oct 21, 2019,
    Last edited Oct 21, 2019
  10. Hey there! I would like to first say that upon reading this thread I noticed it is one of the better threads I have seen with suggestions about cake wars and its kits.

    I believe that removing frosting is not the answer, as achievement kits, hence the name, are a mark of skill and achievement and should therefore be equipped with the items / perks to show that it is. I also believe that this achievement kit mixed up with the kits in the game is a bad idea. In the game, there are three kits. There is Warrior, Builder, and Archer. If we were to apply idea to the game and its current kits, we would have a long range class, movement class, damage class (credit to the author) and a mage class (frosting). I think giving warrior a bit of a boost, which I will get into specifics on later, would be a perfect balance to the system.

    However, I don't see adding the Tank kit/ class as necessary or helpful. It would make another kit that is too powerful, and would make it hard for any other kit but warrior to kill, thus making it one of the most powerful in the game. I could see something similar working, and would like to see a new kit, but ultimately I don't think that the tank kit is a good representation of a balanced kit system.

    Now about warrior, I could see one of two things being changed about the kit:

    1. The player gets 1 level of strength for every kill they get, up to strength 5. After 8 seconds of not getting a kill, all levels of strength go away. This would make combos more effective, and allow a player to fight off enemies faster and tank hits slightly better.

    2. The player gets a small strength buff added on for every kill they get, like .25, and goes away when the player dies. Note: this is not my idea, I just think it would work well.

    As always, I appreciate you making this thread and I think that it has the potential to be very beneficial for the CakeWars community.

    Thanks!
     
    Posted Oct 21, 2019
  11. The only thing I want to point out is that they never suggested the removal of frosting kit, they merely said that no one would use warrior and this causes imbalance, as currently there is not a good kit that counters frosting in up close fighting.
     
    Posted Oct 21, 2019
    saltyfishhy likes this.
  12. jeez, i made a typo with the 0. end of the world? you wrote "siad" as opposed to "said". doesn't matter because the intent is easily understood either way. some people...

    So... basically Wolf from SSM? Yea no thanks, I've had enough of that for several lifetimes.
     
    Posted Oct 21, 2019
  13. lol SSM is completely different. The wolf is counterable and the warrior kit would only have 1 perk, also I would like to point out that ANY damage you receive would remove the effect, ie fall dmg dmg, dmg from arrows, traps, fireballs, and swords all would negate the effect instantly. If your good at pvp this kit can be countered very easily. If your bad then why dont you use archerers and stay away from people? This kit would be rewarding for skilled players and it WOULD be balanced
     
    Posted Oct 21, 2019
  14. Every time I see this argument being made, I die inside a little bit more. No, achievement kits shouldn't be flat-out better than their stock and purchasable counterparts. They should be viable sidegrades and nothing more. Just because you've played more than jose_gonzales2007 doesn't mean you should steamroll him regardless of his actual skill
     
    Posted Oct 21, 2019
  15. Fair point, and I totally see where you're coming from. I'm not suggesting that it should remain significantly better than the other kits. I, somewhat like OP, am just suggesting that the improvements that need to be made should be directed towards the kit system as a whole, not just frosting.

    Although I only listed the improvements I would like to see made to warrior, my opinion is that all kits should be revised a little bit to make the system better.

    One thing I could suggest for frosting right off the bat though is less snowballs. It is way too easy to get spammed with snowballs and at that point trying is useless, however I still think they and the kit should be included in the game.

    Thanks for the feedback!
     
    Posted Oct 21, 2019
  16. There is so much to take apart here I honestly don't know where to start.

    Anything is counterable, but if something requires more effort to counter than there is effort being put into it in the first place, or its only counter is itself (doesn't TRULY apply to wolf but an important point nonetheless), something isn't right.

    And I would like to point out that this would make it hilariously bad. For proof, reference the Baby-Face's Blaster, a primary weapon for the Scout from TF2.

    To wrap things up here, a Bloodlust-esque effect like I suggested (more damage per kills, stacks until it maxes out) is a lot more balanced than the Ravage-like ability you suggested. If you read my initial post instead of just looking for typos, you would know I more than fully support this kit; just... not your iteration of it.
     
    Posted Oct 21, 2019
  17. To start when you say that some things take more effort to counter and that whole point just dosnt make much sense... If it requires more effort than what is being put into it? What is that? What effort is being put in? I am sure you have a point if you reword it and I am probably just being dumb XD also the warrior would be counterable by other kits with the modifications I said, so that rules out the other half of your point. As for your second point I 1) dont know what you are referencing, and 2 understand that this can be countered easily, BUT skilled players can use it well. If you are close enough to attack someone with a sword then they probably are not going to be hitting you with a bow, using fireballs that can also kill themself, if you are hit with a trap then your probably not fighting, and fall dmg would probably be large and would be the result of your opponent hitting you. So all in all, that would not make the kit bad. If you are good enough at PvP to not be hit or if you are going against large groups this kit would be good. Also I never said that you didnt want the warrior to be modified or that you were against the idea of it, I am fine with you being against my version of the kit, I pointed out 1 typo and I wasn't being mean about it, and while your version of the kit would be balanced, it could also be underpowered. I know my version can have the same problem but that will depend on a players skill, and not as much the kit itself.
     
    Posted Oct 21, 2019
  18. On bedrock with the warrior kit every kill we get we get regen II for 2 seconds and Strength I for 3 seconds. Thats what Java is missing for the warrior kit
     
    Posted Oct 21, 2019
  19. For YOU specifically and for the sake of your own viewing pleasure, I have created a brief, color-coded, easily understood diagram explaining my message. Please, take a look :)

    [​IMG]
     
    Posted Oct 21, 2019
  20. Lol ig I am just dumb XD
     
    Posted Oct 21, 2019

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